182. WILLIAM PATMORE proceedingsdefend was indicted for that he, and one RACHEL WALTERS < no role > , not having the fear of God before their eyes, but being moved and seduced by the instigation of the devil, contriving and intending Mary Patmore proceedingsvictim , the wife of him the said William Patmore < no role > , feloniously to starve, kill, andmurder, on the third day of January, at the parish of St. Dunstan, Stebon Heath , and continually afterwards to the 25th of the said month, on the said Mary Padmore < no role > , in the peace of God and our Lord the King, then and there being feloniously, wilfully, and of their malice afore thought, did make an assault; and that he the said William Patmore < no role > her the said Mary Patmore in a room, in his dwelling-house, did confine and imprison; and that he till the said 25th of the said month, at the parish aforesaid, feloniously, wilfully, and of his malice aforethought, did neglect, omit, and refuse to give and administer to her his wife sufficient meat, drink, and assistance, by means of which said confinement, and also for want of such sufficient meat, drink, and assistance, she from the 3d of January till the 25th of the said month, at the parish aforesaid, did languish, and became greatly ematiated in her body, on which said 25th of January , in the parish aforesaid, she of such confinement and imprisonment, and for want of such meat, drink, and assistance, did die; and so the jurors say that he the said William Patmore her the said Mary Patmore < no role > , his wife, in manner aforesaid, feloniously, wilfully, and of his malice aforethought, did kill and murder . The said William Patmore < no role > also stands charged with the like murder on the coroner's inquisition.

(The case opened by Mr. Silvester.)

May it please your lordship, and you, gentlemen of the jury, the prisoner at the bar, William Patmore, stands charged with the wilful murder of his wife; murdered, if true, in a most cruel and deliberate way. Gentlemen, you have heard the charge stated to you by the officer, that by confinement and for want of food, he has been the death of his nearest and dearest relation. Gentlemen, it becomes my duty, though a very painful one, indeed, to state a case of his kind to you, to charge a man with wilful murder, for which this prosecution is taken up by the officers of the parish, who think it their duty whenever a death happens by violence, or any suspicion lights upon any person that has been the occasion of this death, to bring the case before a court and jury; having no wish but that justice should take place, and that you should judge in publick of the prisoner how far he is guilty of this charge; a more serious one cannot come before a court of justice. But, gentlemen. the more serious the charge is, the stricter evidence you will require. If you are perfectly satisfied that he is guilty of murder, I am sure you will pronounce him so by your verdict. Gentlemen, the prisoner was a staymaker , and kept a house in High Street, in the hamlet of Mile End : his wife, to whom he had been married about fourteen years, had not resided with him for between 12 and 13 years; but in the begining of November, or the latter end of October last, being then big with child, and lame in one of her knees, the officers of the parish in which she was, applied to her husband, and told him he must take care of his wife. She then was conveyed from the lodging where she lived, in a hackney coach, to the house of the prisoner; she was unable to walk, and was therefore carried up into the back garrat of the prisoner's house; he cohabiting at the same time with another woman, in the same house; in this back garrat there was no fire-place, and only one chair; and the only thing she had to lay upon was some garden mats; the only thing to cover her was some sackcloth: in that situation, with child, and lame, there it was she was confined and unable to stir. Before he brought her home, and after he had brought her home, he declared that she should have no other assistance and support but the rind of rusty pieces of bacon, rotten potatoes, cold turnips, and now and then a dry herring. From the month of November till the month of January she continued in that state; but she was so weak and so ill at the time, that when he tried the experiments of putting the miserable food which he brought her at a distance and out of her reach, she was unable to get atit. At another time he lost the window and the door open; but she was unable to shut either, because she was weak and seeble. On the third of January she was delivered of a child, which child soon died. She continued alive till the 25th of January, and then departed this life. Her death, and the declaration the prisoner had frequently made, not only that he would dispose of the child by selling it, but likewise of his deceased wife, created an alarm in the neighbourhood; the officers of the parish went there, and found this woman in a most miserable situation: surgeons attended the coroner, but not knowing any thing of the treatment she had met with, observed on her person no particular marks, or any thing to which they could, from outward appearance, say was the cause of her death; there was a mortification on her back, but that might be owing to her laying hard, and receiving injury from the coldness of the weather, which was remarkably cold, and having no bed. However, some time after, two surgeons were sent for, and the body was opened: on opening the body, they found in the stomach but a very small quantity (about a tea cup full) of fluid; the intestines were entirely empty; in short, by the appearance of the inside, they had little doubt but that this woman got her death by being deprived of natural food. Gentlemen, that circumstance alone, independant of any other, would certainly not be sufficient to induce you to find any one guilty of starving a person to death; because the emptiness of the stomach, the emptiness of the intestines, may be from natural causes; from illness, from a desire of not taking food, from inability of digestion: you will therefore not argue merely on that circumstance, but couple together the circumstances of the treatment she met with from him, with the examination of the body, and the observation of the surgeons; and taking both together you will consider whether they do not convince you, that this woman met with her death by the hard usuage, and by the want of food which she experienced at the time; upon this you are to judge, first, whether she met with her death from the want of necessary food, which she ought to have received; the next consideration is, whether that man, who is her husband, in whose care and custody this woman was, whether it was not his duty to have supported her, by giving her that food which nature required. Gentlemen, this case which I have opened, I am sure you all shudder at; but at the same time I am sure you will hear it with coolness and impartiality; you will not let the action, cruel as it is, influence your minds against the prisoner; but you will judge on the evidence coolly and dispationately; and if that evidence convinces you that he has been the wicked instrument of depriving that woman of life, it become your duty to pronounce him guilty: if, on the other hand, a doubt should remain on your minds much better, he should be acquitted. Gentlemen, among the rest of the testimony which I have to lay before you, is the testimony of one, which I feel it my duty to state to you, though I state it with reluctance. I have among the list of my witnesses, a daughter of this man, who was the daughter of the deceased; and perhaps I shall find myself bound to call her before you. It is a painful talk upon me to call a child against a parent; it is what nature shudders at; but in a crime like that, where a man has deprived of life the tenderest and nearest relation, I do not know whether I am justified in keeping back any witness whatever. She is a girl of 12 years old; you will see her, and you will judge; and from you I wish to receive my instructions, whether I ought or ought not to call her; she shall be produced; but I will not stain your minds by opening a single circumstance that that child can prove; if it is to come, I would rather it should come from her mouth than from mine. Gentlemen, I will now call the witnesses; and if the facts are proved clearly, that none of you have a doubt, it will then become your painful duty to pronounce him guilty. If, on the other hand,either my witnesses should fail in proving it or he, by producing witnesses, can prove to your satisfaction that he has not been the instrument of her death, I, for one, shall rejoice in your verdict of acquittal.

HENRY EYRE < no role > sworn.

I am one of the churchwardens of Mile End, New Town. The prisoner is a stay-maker, and lives in High-street. The first information I received of this very alarming business, was on Wednesday, the 28th of January. I went to the house of the prisoner on that day; I went up the three pair of stairs front garret to view the body; the appearance was the greatest scene of distress I ever saw; I saw the human body on the straw, and a few rags underneath, which were cut from her back all swarming with vermin: the appearance of the sight was extremely shocking; her skin was like a Mulatto; her belly shrunk in, her ribs started. I have done every thing in my power to bring the offender to justice.

Court. This was a three pair of stairs room? - A three pair of stairs front garret.

Was it dry and wholesome? - Yes, it was dry, seemingly; there was no appearance of water; I only saw her in the front garret, that was dry.

Was there any furniture there? - I did not see any; there was a crutch, and some of her cloaths which had been pulled off.

ANN BUTLER < no role > sworn.

I know the prisoner very well; I know his wife; she lodged with me two years backs; I went, in November, to carry her a few things, such as tea, sugar, &c. I had heard her husband had fetched her away from where she lodged, in October, and I went to her husband's, William Patmore < no role > , in November; when I came there I saw the prisoner, and I asked him to make a pair of stays for my little girl; and I asked him about his wife, the deceased: he said nobody should see her; he told me he would tell me the situation she was in; that she was in a back garret; that he had sent her up a mat, and a piece of wood for her head, and potatoes and rinds of bacon; that was what he had fed her on, and what he should keep her on; and that when she was dead he should sell her body to the surgeons. He would not let me see her at that time; that was the first time I went; I can't recollect the time. She had been at home then three weeks. I am almost sure it was in November. In a fortnight afterwards I went to the prisoner's house again, the second time of my going, when I got to see her; it was a great while before Mr. Patmore consented to my going up to her; at last he did, but he sent this Rachel Walters < no role > with me. She was in a back garret.

Did the prisoner live in the house himself? - Yes, Sir; below stairs. This Rachel Walters < no role > passed for his wife, and he used to call her his wife. I went up stairs, I found her (the deceased) in a back garret: directly that I entered the room, there she sat on a mat, on the ground, fronting the door, and as soon as she see me she bursted into tears; the first word the deceased said, was, - I'm very hungry, the child gnaws me. I pulled out a piece of roast mutton that I had got in one pocket, and some bread out of the other, which I gave to her, and she eat it very ravenous. This Rachel Walters < no role > was with me at the time; she begged of me to go to persuade her husband to let her go to the parish. I came down and talked to the prisoner. I said, you had better let her go to the parish, or to the hospital, or somewhere, than let her be in that situation. He said, she should go to no parish; he said it was his pleasure to keep her so, and he would; and he said, he would not lay out sixpence on her. I begged, and said a great deal to him to let her go. I went again; I believe then she had been ten or eleven weeks in that situation; this was the third time; I think I can recollect the time, for William Patmore came to me on the 10th, and Iwas there the Sunday before; and he gave me a receipt for 18 s. it is dated on the 10th of January. I was at his house on the Sunday before; he dated it for Saturday, saying it would not stand good on Sunday. When I was there, I asked him if he would let me go up, and let her write to a gentleman she knew, one Mr. Austens, and I would try to get her two or three guineas, to get her into the hospital or workhouse: I made that an excuse to go up stairs; and after that, with a long persuasion, he let me go up stairs. He did not know I had any thing in my pocket. I found her in the same back garret, and it was very wet then, but I did not see any wet the other time. The first word she said then, she told me she was very dry; then I gave her a bottle of beer that I had under my arm; and I opened a handkerchief full of victuals; and I told her to keep her spirits up, and I would try to get her out of that situation. I had apples, and onions, and bread and cheese in my handkerchief; she was very fond of onions and bread and cheese; I had halt a quartern loaf, and in my pocket I had some beef steak pudding, which I gave her. She was sitting on the mat; there was no bed, nor do I know that there was any fire-place; she had nothing but the mat, and a piece of wood to put under her head: there was no chair, nor stool, nor nothing. Then I came down stairs, and found he was blowing the fire, to make a good fire against I came down. I told him it was a shocking thing for her to be in that situation, and she had better go to the parish. Rachel Walters < no role > would not give me leave to speak till she had told him I had given her a good deal of victuals; and he flew into a passion, and said, if he had known, I should not have gone up stairs: he said I should never see her any more, come when I would. I said I should tell the parish officers; and he said no parish officers should come there. I have told you the heads of it. He said she should not go, she should stay there, and I should never see her any more.

Prisoner. May I be permitted to ask the gentlewoman a question. The first time you came to my house, Mrs. Butter, did not you come rather forward in liquor, or apparently very full of talk, and abusive; and did not you send my little girl out for a quartern of rum, and go up stairs and give that woman some rum; and did not I say we were not used to such liquors in our house, we cannot afford it. The first time she came to my house, I believe, to the best of my knowledge, was on a Sunday evening? - It was the middle of the week; he was at his stay work.

Did not you send for a quartern of rum to treat she and yourself? - I sent for a quartern of rum, and desired Mr. Patmore to let her have half a glass; and he said she should have no such indulgence; I paid sixpence for it; I sent for it really and solely for this poor creature to have half a glass of it; I did not send for it for myself.

Court. Had she half a glass of it? - Yes, she had, I know she had.

Prisoner. Did not you give it to her yourself? - No, you would not suffer me to go up.

Court. Then how do you know she had it? - He said he would send her up half a glass; and I said directly, I am an unbelieving Jew; unless you let me take it up myself, I shall not believe she has it; and my child, a little girl of eleven years old, carried it up.

Prisoner. Did I ever refuse your going up stairs to see her till the last time, on account of disturbance; and did not I tell you she had plenty of victuals, more than you had? - No, you said potatoes and rinds of bacon, and that was sufficient.

Court. Did he say she had plenty of food? - Yes, he said she had plenty; and what was she more than a felon?

Prisoner. Did not the deceased say that she was particularly fond of rinds of bacon, being with child? - She has dined with me several times, and I never heard her mention such a word.

Did she say so then? - No.

Did she say so at any time? - I never heard her mention it.

Did not she say that she could eat half a dozen herrings at a meal, if she could get them, with a sufficiency of potatoes: when you asked her what she had had for her dinner, and she said tatoes, and you said, poor creature, had you nothing else; says she, a red herring; and did not she say to you, poor souls, they cannot afford to give me more? - She said no such thing.

Court. I wish you to recollect, as accurately as you can, when the first time was that you saw the deceased? - I cannot tell; but I am sure, by this receipt, the last time was the 4th of January.

Was she at that time with child, or brought to bed? - She was with child both times.

Was she brought to bed on the 4th of January? - No.

The first time you saw her, in what condition did you find her, as to bodily strength and infirmities? - She seemed very weak and low.

Was she able to walk? - No; she was not able to stand.

I am speaking of the first time that you went up to her? - She was on the ground.

Did she attempt to stand? - No. She told me how her legs were swelled; I saw her legs, and her knee.

You never saw her after she was brought to-bed? - No.

How long have you known the prisoner? - Only the beginning of last summer some time.

Do you happen to know how long he has lived there? - No.

When did you first happen to know the wife? - I believe about three years ago; she came to me to take a room; I then lived in Coleman Street parish, in a place called Floyd's yard, London Wall; I had a lower room to let; there was a bill up.

What did she come for? - She took the lower room for a school.

Did she come and live there? - Yes.

How long did she live there? - I can't tell rightly; she paid the rent weekly.

Cannot you tell whether a week, or a month, or one year, or two years? - No, Sir; it was not two years; it was not above one year, if it was that.

What rent did you let the room at? - Two shillings a week.

Did she pay the rent? - She went away in my debt, but she worked it out afterwards by plain work.

Did she keep a school? - She had but two or three scholars, there were so many school about.

Did her husband ever come there? - No, Sir; I never saw him till last summer.

What name did she go by? - Patmore; I never knew her by any other.

Then you did not know that she had a husband till last summer? - Yes, Sir, I heard so.

You do not know when they came together again? - I do not know any further, than I saw him last summer.

Did the prisoner, in any of these conversations that you had with him, make any complaint about his wife? - I never heard him make any.

Did you know, by any means, how long she had been absent from her husband? - I cannot say; only her father and mother they came to and fro' and were there every day.

You say the conversation about potatoes was the first time you went? - Yes.

You did not see the woman then? - No.

You say now, that the conversation passed about the bacon and potatoes before you had seen the woman? - Yes.

In your deposition, you say,

"this deponent hearing that she was there unwell, went for the purpose of seeng her, and did see her in a back garret; and that he gave her rinds of bacon and rotten potatoes." And then you say, that you spoke to him about it, and he said he would keep her in that manner as long as she lived; so that the conversation about bacon and potatoes happened at the time when you saw her.Now, when you saw her, did you think her in a dangerous state? - I thought she was starving, she looked so.

Then, did you or not give any information to the parish officers? - I went to the next door, and to a chandler's shop opposite; I told the neighbours; I did not understand about going to the parish officers.

Did you understand what time the prisoner and the deceased had lived separate from each other? - I did not.

How came you first of all to go to this house? - I went to where she had lodged last; she went from me to be with her father and mother, because the school did not answer, and staid there till her mother died. Her husband did not live with her then. After that she came to my house to know if I had ever a room, and for me to tell her what to do for the best. She was in a deal of trouble; her mother was just dead, and she wanted to move; and I got her a lodging at the next door to me; it was only a shilling a week; her husband came to and fro' the last summer; that was the way I knew him.

How long did she live there? - I do not know.

Where did she go to from that place? - The prisoner fetched her away in a hackney coach, as I was told; I did not see him.

Did you ever hear the prisoner say whether he fetched her away or not? - I cannot say; the prisoner was at my house the beginning of last summer, that was the first time that ever I saw him; I cannot recollect the month; I first saw the prisoner at my own door, he was enquiring after the deceased; he had his daughter with him.

How old was that daughter? - I have heard her mother say she was thirteen years old, when she was living; I believe she is near fourteen.

Then, at that time when you saw the prisoner enquiring for her, he did not know where she was? - No, I believe not; he was enquiring after her.

Did you tell him where she lodged? - He had been at my house, and the next house, where she lodged, but she was not at home; I did not know who he was.

What name did he enquire for? - He enquired for one Harwood; he described her, and I said there was a person that went by the name of Patmore. He asked me if I knew where she was gone.

Was you present at any time when the prisoner and the deceased met together? - Yes; I was there one day when they were at dinner, in her apartment, at the next door; they had buttock of beef for dinner. I never saw him but once at her lodging, but I have seen him down in the yard, I believe, three or four times; three times I am sure.

How long was you there at the time when they were at dinner? - I dare say I staid three quarters of an hour; I sat down, and talked.

During the time you sat there, did any conversation pass between them importing that he was her husband? - I did not know who he was; he passed for her brother; they were talking about the country.

How came you to make any application to the prisoner? - I heard, Sir, the situation she was in.

When you did make applications to him, what were they? - Only begging him to let her go to the parish, or hospital.

Did you make your applications to him as the husband of the deceased? - Yes; I knew then that he was her husband.

What did you say to him? - I said, you had better let Mrs. Patmore, your wife, go away.

Did you say, you had better let her, or Mrs. Patmore? - I never called her any thing but Mrs. Patmore. She never owned to any thing but Patmore. I always called her to him by the name of Patmore.

What was his answer? - He always said that she should be there, in that situation, as long as she lived.

MARY RYLEY < no role > sworn.

I was a lodger to Mr. Patmore. I went to lodge there about the latter end of lastNovember, on a Saturday, but the day of the month I can't recollect. I lodged there about five weeks, and I never knew there was any body in the house but my family, Mr. Patmore, and a woman, ( Rachel Walters < no role > ) which is the second wife. I have five children. Their family consisted of Mr. Patmore, a woman, and the deceased's child, who was between thirteen and fourteen years of age. About four or five weeks after I had been there, the daughter of Mr. Patmore and Rachel Walters < no role > was going out; the daughter came up and said to me - she said - will you be so good as to let us in when we come back; our door is not fit to be left; it is not safe. I said I would. At the same time my husband was bad; I was very ill myself. I went to bed, and desired my husband to let them in. They knocked at the door between light and dark; I said to my husband, there is somebody at the door; he went down and let them in; and when he came up again, I heard something moan twice. This was five weeks after I went there. We heard her once more, and I said to my husband, I hear something moan. He shut the door, and came to bed, for we had very little candle or coals, and were much distressed. I went up into the garret about two or three days after, to see a place that wanted mending; my husband is a plaisterer. I heard the moaning. I see the back garret a-jar, and I looks, and I saw the deceased sit up in a corner, upon a mat; she had got the hood of an old red cloak over her head, and she sat wrapped up in it; and as she sat, she see, sawed. Mrs. Walters says, How are you: she says, It's cold: and then she (Mrs. Walters) said to her, I'm going to get your dinner directly; and down stairs we went; and I saw no more of her till after she was dead. I did not go up any more; I had no time; my husband being so bad, and the children so heavy upon me.

Prisoner. Did not your children go up to see her when they pleased? - Yes, a child of nine or ten years of age has been up; and another of seven went up three or four times with Mrs. Walters.

Did not a girl of fifteen go up? - Yes, at the time your wife's cloaths were cut off Judy went up.

Court. You say you have a child fifteen or sixteen years old that went up on the Sunday with the prisoner? - Yes.

Had she ever gone up by herself? - Not to my knowledge.

Did the other children ever go up by themselves before she died? - Not to my knowledge.

Do you know, in point of fact, whether there was, from time to time, victuals carried up by Mrs. Walters, or any body else, and whom? - I have sworn to it. I have seen it go up many a time; potatoes, I have seen plenty of potatoes, about a pound, or a pound and a half, when boiled, and a red herring, several times.

Can you tell who carried them? - I have seen Rachel Walters carry it, and I have seen the daughter likewise.

Living in the same house, can you inform the court whether her meals were regularly carried up to her? - I did not always see them go regular; but I could hear a step go past my door; what I did not see, oftentimes my children have come in and told me.

Do you recollect when it was she lay in? - I think it was, to the best of my knowledge, the 3d of January, the Saturday after New Year's Day.

Are you pretty positive as to that? - Yes, I do think I could swear to it.

Do you recollect the circumstance of her lying-in? - I was there at the time when she was brought to bed. I was there about one at noon.

You knew she was with child at the time? - Only by hearsay.

Were there any provisions, such as candle, or any thing of that sort, made for her before, or at the time when she was brought to bed? - When I came in, about one the same day, she was brought to bed. Mr. Patmore opened his room door at the same time that I opened the street door:neighbour, says he, I have got a young bantling. Have you, says I, I went in to see the child, and I asked to look at it; when I went in it was laid on the girl's feather-bed, below stairs, and covered over; it was brought down stairs to be dressed; I looked at the child, and said, it is a pretty baby; poor thing, it was a pretty featured child. I looked at it, and saw a blanket hang at the chimney line, a roller, and a cap: and Rachel Walters < no role > said, I have never a shirt to put the child on; but she said Mr. Patmore was going to buy a shirt for the child, and a covering to put on the deceased. I said I would lend her a shirt; I went up stairs, and brought one down, and a girl's cap. Mr. Patmore came in at the same time, with a quilt and a child's shirt; and she wanted to give me my shirt again; but I told her no, it would want another. I never saw the child any more till the Sunday morning.

Was this child a full grown child? - No, it was a small child.

Was it at its full time? - I do think it was; it looked likely to live.

Was there any provision, or proper preparation made for her, at the same time, that she was to take, proper for persons in her condition? - I smelt the spice boiling, and I saw the saucepan on the fire; it appeared to me to be caudle. I only smelt spice, but I saw no liquors.

Did you at any time smell the smell of caudle? - No, I cannot say I ever did after that time.

How long did you happen to know the deceased before you went to live there? - I never saw her in my life, nor Mr. Patmore but once, before I went to live there.

Do you happen to know in what way he lived? - I knew he was a staymaker; but my family was too large for me to be in his room.

Was the sort of food that went up to the deceased, the sort of food that the prisoner had at his table? - I do not know what sort of food the prisoner had at his table.

Prisoner. You remember the size of my poor child's bed; the bed laid on the lid of a sea chest, very small, no larger than a bolster? - It was a child's bed, on a chest, no bigger than this board is; there was no bedstead.

Mr. Peat, prisoner's counsel. My lord, I have this moment received my brief. You was a lodger in the same house with the prisoner? - Yes, in the one pair, over his head.

Was he in the habit of calling this woman his wife; or did he say, the woman, and the woman? - He used to say, her.

Did he say, my wife? - No, Sir.

Who was this large girl by; by this woman, or some other? - By the deceased, I understood.

Did the prisoner and his supposed wife live in the same room together? - Yes, they did.

Did it happen to you to hear their conversation at any time? - Very seldom.

Do you recollect at any time the deceased sending the child for provisions to her husband? - No; I have seen her carry it up stairs.

How long was that before her death? - Several times.

Was you called in to her assistance? - No.

Do you know whether she refused her provisions through illness? - That I cannot say.

Did you ever observe any ill treatment from the prisoner to any person, or cruelty, or ill-humour? - No, I never did.

Did he conduct himself in a good-humoured quiet manner? - It was a very quiet house, while I was in it, till this affair.

You never heard any noises, or murmurs, or complaints, when you was out of the room? - No, never.

Never heard the deceased complain in any mode? - No.

Or any thing that indicated immediate distress, or ill treatment from any person? - No, Sir, never.

HANNAH TAYLOR < no role > sworn.

I live in High Street, Mile End, New Town, No. 10, opposite where the prisonerlived. I go out a nursing. The prisoner came to my house about 11 o'clock, in the day time of the third of January; he told me Mrs. Haynsworth told him to come over to me, and desired me to come. Mrs. Haynsworth lives next door to him, and sells milk. He said there was a poor creature in great extremity, and great distress, in the back room; he said she had had goods, but she was obliged to part with them to pay her rent; he had gave her house-room to shelter her from the weather; and he was come into a great deal of trouble. I asked him why he did not put her into the workhouse; he said the parish officers would have nothing to do with her; because he took her in, they would oblige him to take care of her. He asked me if I would be so good as to go over; I said I would, and I went with him to his house. He told me to go up stairs, his wife was above. I went up two pair of stairs; I met Mrs. Haynsworth coming down. She said, neighbour Taylor, I am glad you are come, for I never saw such a scene in my life. When I got up the third pair of stairs, Rachel Walters < no role > was standing in the back garret, and the deceased was lying down. I said the room was very wet; and she signified it was water; but the room was very wet all over. Rachel said the deceased was in labour. I asked her if she had sent for the midwife; she said no, they did not know where one lived. I told her where one lived, and then the deceased spoke; she said there was no cause for a midwife, the child was in the world, if I would be so good as to take it. I told her I would, but I had much rather they would have somebody else, and to send for a midwife. I told them if I did take it, I must have something to wrop it up in. Rachel called down to the prisoner to bring up a coarse apron and a needle full of thread. I parted the child, and wropt it up in the coarse apron, and gave it to Rachel. The deceased told me all was ready for me. I said that she ought to have something warm, for the place was so wet it was enough to perish her, and if she had a little dry straw under her, it would be better than lying so. Rachel told her she should have something warm as fast as possible. We came down stairs, and the prisoner was standing there in the entry; and Rachel says, Patmore, step one side a minute; which he did; then he came into the front room below stairs, and told me if I had a mind to see her (the deceased's) husband, I might; he lived in Church Row, Aldgate; his name was Hayward, or Harewood, an ivory-turner; but, he says, I am the first. Why, says I, if her husband lives in Church Row, and you are the first - I thought this had been your wife? So she is, says he; so Rachel replies, so I am his wife, and she had been married to him eleven years last October, she told me. I told him I thought it was a comical sort of mess of marrying; but nevertheless the woman above must have something to cover her. There was a pot of beer standing on the table, and some oatmeal, and some spice; I put some on, and boiled some caudle, about a pint, and I put some gin in it, and I would have carried it up, but Rachel would not let me; she sent the daughter. The girl came down, and said the deceased wanted a piece of bread toasted. I toasted a piece, and the girl took that up. The prisoner went out, and when he came back he brought in an old quilt and a truss of straw; be carried it up stairs into the front garret; he came down stairs again, and said he had made her up a very good bed; I told him I could not move her myself, and he helped me to move her out of the back garret into the fore garret, and when we laid her down there, I asked her how she did, she said she was pure comfortable, and thanked me for making the caudle; I asked her if she drank it, she told me she did; the prisoner said to her, you shall want for nothing till your month is up; if you do not go from me then, I will put you to Bridewell; she asked him to shake hands and to forgive her; he told her he would not touch such a wretch as she was, for she had been his utter destruction; she replied to him again, you havecommitted faults as well as I have committed faults; the deceased told him that he had been married to this Rachel so long.

How long? - Eleven years; and he told her she had been married to Hayward, I think Harewood, but I am not certain which, longer than he had been to Rachel; that discourse passed several times over and over; so interfering, with that, I asked her whose child that was; then she pointed to the prisoner, and said it was his; he said it was not; she said it was; so then, says he, I suppose it is the paper bag man's; I must go and get a paper bag to put it in; then she made no more reply at all, and we came down stairs; then, when we came down stairs, both Rachel and he said she should want for nothing, and said she should have every thing that was necessary as fast as they could get it; then I dressed the child: he brought in three quarters of flannel, which he brought in for a blanket, a shirt, cap and roller; they then said she should want for nothing till her month was up, when, he said, he would put her to Bridewell; he should insist on doing it then. Then I went over to a neighbour's house to inform them of the situation she was in.

Mr. Silvester. Describe the garret you found her in? - It was very wet; there was neither bed, bedstead, chair, stool, or any thing in it; she was laying on two garden mats. I saw one, they said there were two: she had an old black crape gown, an old petticoat, and a piece of an old light-coloured cloak, a smallish cloak, a piece of sacking about three quarters of a yard long, or a yard at furthest; there were a few bits of nasty dirty rags; the child was nearly at its full time, it was a small child, it had its nails, its hair on its head, and every thing proportionable.

Was there any thing particular in the child that struck you at the time? - No.

Mr. Peatt. Was that the first time you ever saw the deceased? - No.

Then you do not know how long she had been in the garret? - No; he signified to me, it was a person he had sheltered from the weather for a night or two.

What was in the front garret? - Nothing at all, only some broken cieling laying on the floor.

Then you do not know how she had been lodged before that moment that you saw her? - No, I do not.

In the course of the altercation between the deceased and the prisoner, he said repeatedly that she was married to this Hayward? - Yes.

She did not deny it? - No, nor she did not deny it any further than telling him he was married first.

Did she complain of any ill-treatment in your presence? - She did not, for I never was alone by myself; they would not let me go up by myself.

Was the bed as comfortable as it could be made of such materials? - Yes.

Did the woman appear totally strong for a woman in her condition? - She spoke very hearty, considering how she had lain in the wet.

But you do not know how long she had been in that room? - I do not.

Court. When did you see this woman afterwards? - I never saw her afterwards; I went over on the Sunday morning, she was brought to bed on the Saturday; I went over the Sunday, which was the 4th, about 11; I saw Rachel standing at the door; I did not see the prisoner.

How long did the deceased live afterwards? - She lived to the 25th of January; I never was at the house at all till she was dead, because I was called out on Tuesday, to nurse a woman.

Then you know nothing of the care that was taken of her between the 3d and 25th? - No, I did not see her; I was not there.

You tell us there was a considerable number of words between the deceased and this woman, saying that the prisoner had been married to Rachel Walters eleven years; likewise saying, as I understoodyou, that she and the prisoner had been married together; did the prisoner deny that? - No, he did not.

Then the prisoner did not deny his having been married to the deceased; if I understand you right the prisoner taxed her with having been married to a man of the name of Harwood, or Haywood; did she admit that, or deny it? - She replied that the prisoner was married to Rachel before she was married to Harwood.

Did it appear to you when she was married to Harwood? - In the month of June.

What year? - Why take eleven from - 1789, the wife was married in June to Harwood, and the prisoner in October to Rachel.

Now from their conversation, did it at all appear where the deceased had lived? - By what passed between them, it appeared, that she had lived along with Harwood, and had had eleven children by him.

How long was this conversation? - It might be the space of a quarter of an hour, for it was spoke as fast as I could speak.

Now then will you recollect, whether it appeared how lately the deceased had lived with Harwood? - She had been away from him about two years, as they said in their discourse; I know no further; and that that Harwood was married to another woman.

Had the prisoner passed for the husband of this Rachel Walters < no role > for any time? - She went by the name of Patmore, as she told me; Rachel Walters < no role > said her name was Rachel Patmore < no role > .

Mr. Peatt. You observed that the prisoner acknowledged he was married, in consequence of some question that was put to him by the deceased? - Yes.

Did you understand it so, or whether the man said in express words, that he was married to the deceased? - No, it was not in express words.

Did he say the word married? - Yes, he did, he said, you was married to the ivory turner, to Harwood first; no, says the deceased.

Did he in your presence, at any time, use the words married, as applied to the deceased and himself? - Yes, he did to Rachel.

Did he use the word married, as applied to the deceased? - What, to the deceased.

Aye, to the deceased? - Yes, he said he was married to the deceased.

How did he express himself? - He told her, says he, we were married when you was quite young, to the deceased.

SOPHIA HUTCHINSON < no role > sworn.

I took a room of the prisoner on the 3d of January; I had only been a fortnight in the house when the deceased died; the 3d was the Saturday, the day she was brought to bed, and I went there in the evening; I was there till the day she died, which was on the Saturday night or Sunday morning, about half past two; I saw the baby alive the morning I went there: after I had been there twelve or thirteen days, on a Wednesday night, I heard a very sad groaning all night, it proceeded from out of the back garret, my room was underneath; in the morning I went down and complained to Mr. Patmore, and said what a sad groaning there had been all night, that I could get no rest; and he said that it was a vagrant person whom he had taken out of the street, and she did it to affront his lodgers, and he said he would go up and make her quiet; I heard him go up, but the conversation he had with her I did not hear, but I heard him say, coming down stairs, be easy and be quiet: on the next day I went up to the deceased, she was in the front garret upon some straw, and the room very full of water, she had an old bit of a quilt over her; and the deceased said she was sure she was a dying, and she said all she craved for in this world was a little bread and water boiled thin; she said it was very hard they would not let her have plenty of water; and Rachel Walters < no role > made answer, and said,water was very scarce, and the deceased said, you may easily get as much as I shall drink; I came down stairs, I went to my business, I cannot recollect when I saw the prisoner again; I saw him the night she died.

Did you see him before she died? - Upon my word I cannot recollect.

Had you any conversation with the prisoner at any time previous to her death? - No.

Had you any conversation with him after her death? - No more than he said he was glad she was dead; that was on the Sunday morning after she died; on the Saturday night I went up to my room, and I heard a sad groaning, dismal for any body to hear, and I went to see her as she was dying, and she seemed to lay in great extremity, and had each hand up to the side of her hair fighting with death: I told Patmore, the prisoner, it was very proper somebody should pray by her; he said she is past hearing or feeling, and praying; I offered to go and read prayers by her, he said it was of no signification, and he went down stairs; she died on that night; I heard him and Rachel go up again, and they came down together very shortly. In an hour after that I heard him come up to my door, but he did not go up to her any more; the deceased ceased groaning about half past two on Sunday morning, at which time we supposed she had died, she was by herself; and the body remained there till Wednesday, when in the morning, as I was going to work, I asked him if he was going to bury the poor woman; he said, neighbour, I shall get shut of her to day; he said he had got two fellows that would do any thing for a trifle of money; that he was going to give each of them a shilling a piece, and three quarterns of gin, to take her body away in a sack, and throw her in the Thames at night, or any where, so long as he got shut of her out of his house; and I made answer and said, this poor woman never will go into a sack; and I dont know what answer he made me; I then went about my business.

Prisoner. I never changed three words with you in my life? - It is a great falsity.

Prisoner. Did not I say that I would sell my own bed, or least ways Rachel's bed, to get a coffin for her, to get her buried? - I never heard any such words mentioned, he never talked about a coffin; he talked of making away with her otherwise, but the surgeons would not have her.

Prisoner. Are you that man's wife that lodged in my back chamber on the second floor? - Yes.

Did not your husband say that there was always a sufficiency of victuals? - I did not mind any thing about it.

Did not you go up stairs with me, and I said, the Lord have mercy upon you, the Lord have mercy upon you, says I, Mary, do you know me? - I did not go up with you.

Mr. Peatt. It was on the Sunday morning, I think, you say that you heard groans? - About half after two she ceased groaning.

There were other persons in the house? - Yes.

How many hours was it before you heard the groaning that you saw the deceased? - I had not seen her from the Thursday till the Saturday night that she died, I saw her on Saturday night between ten and eleven.

Did she complain on the Thursday for the want of any kind of food? - Not when I was by.

Did she charge any body with neglect or cruelty? - No Sir, not when I was present, she did not mention a word about it.

Did she on Saturday complain of any species of cruelty? - She was speechless then.

Did you at any time hear any thing like violence in the room where she lay? - I was only at home in the evening.

Did you observe any thing in the prisoner's behaviour to her that was cruel or unmanly? - I heard the prisoner speakmonsterously against her, but I did not perceive any thing in his behaviour.

Court. You took your lodging of the prisoner? - Yes.

Was it a ready furnished lodging? - No Sir, an empty room at a shilling a week.

Mr. Silvester. Now, my Lord, I purpose calling this young woman, Mary Patmore < no role > .

Court. She is a competent witness, if you in point of discretion and delicacy think proper to call her.

MARY PATMORE < no role > , sworn.

How old are you, my little woman? - I am thirteen, the 7th of last October.

Where have you lived, my dear? - Along with my father, for about three years.

Have you ever been at school? - Yes.

Can you say your Catechism? - Yes.

The Lord's prayer? - Yes.

Do you know what you are brought here for? - Yes.

For what? - To speak the truth.

Truth about what.

Mr. Peatt. My lord, I cannot object to this witness's competency, but it seems a very unfit thing to examine her.

Court. Let the council for the prosecution exercise his own discretion; she is competent, certainly:

Mr. Silvester. What are you to speak the truth about (after a long pause and the question several times repeated). My dear, you know you are upon your oath? - Yes.

What is the meaning of taking an oath, for what purpose are you sworn? - No answer.

Do you know the nature of an oath my dear? - Yes.

What is the nature of it? - That I should speak the truth.

Do you know that you will be punished, not only in the next world but in this, if you speak any thing else but the truth? - Yes.

Do you know that man at the bar? - Yes.

Is he any relation of yours? - Yes.

What relation? - My father.

How long have you lived with him? - About three years.

How many were there of you in family? - Three.

Who were they? - Rachel Walters < no role > , my father, and me.

Where did your mother live? - At London Wall.

Do you know when she left London Wall? - About the latter end of October.

Where did she go to then? - To my father's.

Were you at home then? - Yes.

What manner did she come in? - In a coach.

Where did she go to then? - Into the back garret.

Did she go herself? - No, my father and the coachman carried her up.

Had she any table, or chairs, or bed in that back garret? - There was one chair when she first came.

Was there any bed? - No bed.

What did she lay upon? - Upon two gardner's mats.

How long did she continue there? - Till she was brought to bed.

Was she ever out of that garret? - Not till she was brought to bed.

Could she walk about? - No, she could not walk at all.

How was she fed there? - She had potatoes, for dinner, and rinds of bacon.

Was this every day? - She had it every day for a long while.

Who carried it to her? - I carried it to her myself.

Was you alone when you carried it to her? - Yes.

Had she any thing else but potatoes and rinds of bacon? - A bit of bread.

What had she to drink? - Nothing but water.

After she was brought to bed, where was she moved to? - Into the front garret.

Had she any bed there? - No, but she had some straw.

What was she covered with? - An old quilt.

How was she fed there? - She was fed as she was before, only she had herrings.

How many herrings at a time? - One.

What kind of herrings? - Red herrings.

Had she nothing else from the time she was carried into the front garret till she died? - Nothing else but some mutton, the Sunday and Monday after she was brought to bed.

Did you ever tell your father the situation of the deceased? - No, because he knew it.

Did he ever say any thing about it? - No.

Did he go up stairs to see her sometimes? - He went sometimes.

Did you ever go with him? - No.

Could she have got out of the room at any time? - No, she could neither stand or walk.

How do you know that? - She said so.

Did your mother ever say any thing to you? - No, she never said much to me.

Did you often go up yourself to her? - In the morning, at dinner, and tea time. I went always by myself every day.

What did you carry her in the morning? - A bason of tea, and a bit of bread and butter.

Did you do that daily? - Yes.

How large a bit of bread and butter? - A little thin bit along the loaf, sometimes larger and sometimes less.

Did you take this bread and butter in the morning, after she was brought to bed? - Yes.

Did you continue it from the time she was brought to bed, till the time she died? - Yes, until she could not eat any more.

Now, every day at dinner, what did you carry her? - A red herring and potatoes, sometimes no red herring.

How much potatoes? - Some in a plate, I do not know how much.

Do you know how many potatoes? - No, I do not.

Now, at tea time, what did you carry her? - Bread and butter, and a bason of tea.

How much bread and butter? - A little thin bit along the loaf, the same as in the morning, sometimes larger, and sometimes less.

How thin do you mean, or how thick; was it as thick as this (Holding up the cover of a book)? - I cannot tell exactly.

Was there never more than one bit? - No.

What sized loaf was it? - A quartern loaf.

Was it new bread or stale bread? - Sometimes stale bread, and sometimes new, the same as we had ourselves.

Was it a slice all round the loaf? - Half round the loaf.

What had you for dinner generally? - Sometimes pork, sometimes other meat, and sometimes red herrings and potatoes ourselves.

Had you generally meat for dinner? - We generally had meat for dinner.

Did you ever carry her up any? - No.

What had you for breakfast? - Toast, or bread and butter.

Did you carry her up as much as you eat yourself? - No.

Did you ever carry any toast? - No.

What had you at tea? - The same.

Did you ever carry up more than one piece of bread and butter? - No, not unless it happened to be at the bottom of the loaf; when there was but a little bit of the bottom of the loaf, sometimes a little bit was laid upon it.

What kind of potatoes had you for dinner, the same as you carried up stairs? - They all came out of the same; but if there were any rotten ones, they were picked out for the deceased.

How did your father behave to you? - He behaved very well to me.

(Cross examined by Mr. Peatt.)

Did you carry up the meat yourself, the day and the next day after the deceased was brought to bed? - I carried it up one day, and Rachel Walters < no role > the other day.

Did she ask for any more the day you carried it up? - No.

Did she ask for any more, at the time you carried up the bread and butter and tea? - Yes.

Court. What did you do, when the deceased asked for more bread and butter? - I told my father of it.

What did your father say? - Sometimes he said she should not have any more; at other times, he could not afford it.

How long ago do you remember your mother? - Ever since I could remember; I do not know how long.

Who did you live with, before the last three years that you came to live with your father? - My grandfather and grandmother.

Did you know where your mother lived? - Sometimes in Moorfieds, and at last in Church-row; she lived in several places.

Did you, from time to time, know and see your mother; from the time of your leaving your grandfather's house, till the time that your mother returned to your father? - I saw her once when I first came to London; I went along with her father.

When was that? - A quarter of a year before my father went to live in High-street.

Where did your father live, when your mother came home? - In High-street.

How long ago is that from this time? - Half a year ago, last Christmas.

Do you know of your fathers having seen your mother any time before, and how long before? - About a month before that.

Do you know where? - In Floyd's-yard, London-wall.

Do you remember your father living with your mother, during the last ten or twelve years? - No, he never did, since I can remember.

Do you know whether your father ever saw your mother at any time, before the time you have mentioned? - He has seen her before, but I do not know what time, or any thing about it; he never has seen her, other than when he has seen her in the garret.

JOHN RAMSAY < no role > sworn.

Mr. Silvester. I believe, Sir, you are a pupil student with Mr. Young, who is of eminence in the surgery line, in Coleman-street? - Yes. I recollect the prisoner's face, having seen him twice before; I saw him once at Mr. Young's house, and once at his own house.

Do you recollect the day when he first applied to you? - I believe it was on the 29th of January; the day before he was taken up.

For what purpose did you see him? - He came and enquired for Mr. Young, who was not at home; therefore the servant called me to him; he wished to dispose of the dead body of a lodger, who died at his house; he said it was a female; she had been with him eleven or twelve weeks; that he had incurred considerable expence in keeping her all that time: and that now she was dead, and the parish officers had refused to bury her; he thought it but right, that he should get something for her body, as he could not afford to bury her himself: this was about three or four o'clock in the afternoon; I waited to inform Mr. Young, but as he did not come home, I went without his knowledge, about six or seven, and saw the body, but I did not take it. I never saw him before that; that is the only transaction respecting the woman; at the same time, I had another transaction with him; he then told me that the woman had been brought to bed about two weeks; that the child was dead, and he was unable to bury it; and wanted me to take the child: he had previous to this, shewn me a certificate from a searcher, who had searched the body of the woman, but not of the child; he brought the child, for which I paid him four shillings. I saw the corps, but I refused it; it lay on straw, in a very horrid situation; I made no further observation; I immediately came out again.

Prisoner. Every thing is not put into the brief that should have been, because we had not time. Young man, did not I say to you, it was a pity; it could help what the mother had done; and that I would endeavour to keep it longer, and bury it? - No, my friend, you said no such thing to me.

Dr. - DENNISON sworn.

On the 30th I saw the corps; it was in a most wretched condition, as to filth and vermin. I examined it only externally, when I found no marks of violence. A report, I found, had been circulated, that attempts had been made to consume the body by fire. I attended, therefore, particularly to that circumstance, and I am persuaded that no such attempts had been made; for what were supposed to have been the effects of fire, were nothing more than the effects of mortification: the lower extremities, the legs and thighs, were exceedingly swelled; a circumstance which, I believe, may very well be explained, in consequence of her situation as a lying-in woman. The upper part of her body appeared in a very ematiated state, as the face, the arms, and the trunk; that was all I observed.

At that time she was neither opened by you nor Mr. Young, who was with you? - She was not; therefore I only speak of the outward appearance.

Mr. Peatt. Is a slice of bread and butter in the morning and afternoon sufficient food to keep a person alive that is in a weakly state of body? - I cannot answer that question; that depends upon circumstances: it depends, perhaps, on the mode of life the woman had been accustomed to before. If she had been accustomed to live tolerably well before, and had eaten animal food, I should then say it was not.

I do not ask you whether it was sufficient sustenance, but whether it was sufficient to keep any person alive? - In the early stage of her lying-in, what we call the puerperal state, I should esteem it proper.

I do not ask you whether it was proper food for a woman in that condition, but whether the food she did receive was sufficient to keep a person alive? - That depends on the quantity; if the quantity is excessively small, I would then say, it is not.

With the addition of some potatoes, and a herring, sometimes meat, these things taken together, are they not sufficient to keep a subject alive, and free from the effects of hunger and starving? - I should imagine they are.

Court. I think you say you saw this corps just seven days after she had died? - I could not exactly learn when she did die.

Could you, at all, judge, at the distance of five days, whether the deceased died for want of assistance? - If I was to speak from the appearance of the upper part of the body, from the ematiated stare, I might be led to think so; but it would be speaking very uncertainly.

I believe, Sir, you told us there was a mortification? - There was.

Did it appear to you that she might die of that mortification? - I think she might.

What, in your judgment, did you suppose that mortification might proceed from? - From an impoverished state, and the consequence of laying in that sort of condition; that, I think, will sufficiently explain the cause of the mortification.

The swelling of the inferior extremities, that you were speaking of, that is a circumstance that is every now and then found in newly delivered women? - Yes.

But can you decide, from what you saw, any cause of her death? - I cannot.

You would not venture to swear, that she died either from one cause or another? - By no means.

Mr. YOUNG.

I beg your lordship's patience, while I speak for a few minutes. I dare say your lordship will be very glad to hear any thing that may have a tendency to throw light on this subject.

Court. I shall be very glad, Sir, to hear any thing that tends to explain this matter, because justice is as much due to the publick, that this man, if guilty, should suffer, as that he should be acquitted, if innocent.

Sworn.

My lord, what I have to say relates alone to the appearances after death.

Court. How long, Sir, have you been a surgeon? - I have been of the Company of surgeons near fifteen years, and in the practice of surgery many years more. I saw the dead body at the same time with Dr. Dennison. There were, as he says, no external marks of violence. The upper parts of the body were, as he says also, greatly ematiated; but not more, I believe I can say truly, not so much as I have seen repeatedly in dead bodies, who during life had received every possible mark of attention and kindness; but the mortification of which you have heard was very large and deep.

How deep? - There was a slough, as we call it, at one part, nearly a quarter of an inch thick, and almost to the bone. I will take upon me to say, that what whatever cause produced the mortification, was sufficient, in conjunction with that, as an effect, to have been the immediate cause of her death. I add this, because it has respect to an inference that might have been drawn for the want of stating these facts.

Mr. Silvester. What caused the mortification, I suppose, it is impossible to say? - I cannot take upon me absolutely to say. In all probability, hardships of various kinds, and pressure from hard laying. There is no question but poor living would dispose to it; whether from incapacity by illness, or any other cause, she was prevented from taking the accustomed, or necessary quantity of nourishment; or from refusal of it by those who ought to have administered it. A number of concurring circumstances, producing weakness and bad health, would dispose to it; and pressure from hard laying might immediately produce it.

Court. In what part was the mortification? - On the posteriors. It has been suggested, that the mortification was produced by the application of fire. I did not, at the time I examined the body, suspect this; but I will not take upon me to say that it was not produced by fire.

(Cross Examination.)

Mr. Peatt. Dr. Young, subjects in that state, I believe, generally require less food to sustain life, than those in health? - If that question should be entered into critically, the contrary may also be said to be true.

I do not mean to enter into it critically, I want an affirmative or negative to the question? - Neither a negative nor an affirmative can be given to the question because it is too general.

Well then, Sir, to be more particular, is not a single potatoe administered in twenty four hours sufficient to keep a subject alive for a fortnight? - Scarcely you or me I believe, Sir.

Do you think it would be sufficient if it was two or three? - If you speak of possibility, a person might live, under some circumstances, so long, without any thing; such instances are recorded.

In your judgment, would you pronounce such a subject, fed as I have stated, died for want of food? - I might be of opinion that such an one died for want of sufficient food.

But if we add bread and butter twice a day, and a red herring, and sometimes meat, would you say so? - As far as I can judge, from such a general statement, where precise quantity is not ascertained; but the expressions used, are, a bason of tea, and a slice of bread and butter, in the morning; a plate of potatoes and red herring, or sometimes meat, for dinner; and another bason of tea, and slice of bread and butter, in the afternoon. I should think so long as that was continued therecould not be a just charge of want, that would amount to the idea of starving.

Not an absolute want? - No.

I think you say, Sir, that it is possible for a person to live fourteen or fifteen days, without any food at all? - I did, but think it is requisite they should be well lined.

Aye, aye, aye! I believe there have been instances of persons living for years, upon a single egg a day? - Perhaps there may.

JOHN GILLSON < no role > sworn.

I am a surgeon, I have been in the practice of surgery, twenty years; I opened the deceased's dead body, on Tuesday, the third of February.

What were the appearances, first of all of the stomach? - Nearly empty.

What was in it? - A fluid, which a tea cup might contain.

Did you open the intestines? - I did not.

Did you examine them? - I did.

In what state were they? - They appeared nearly empty.

What conclusion do you draw from the appearance of the body, in the opening of it? - I should not have opened the body, but at the request of the parish officers, for I did not apprehend I could gain any information from that; when I saw the mortification, I was satisfied, in my own mind, that was the cause of her death; there are no symptoms which usually attend in a mortification; but I expected to find the stomach and bowels empty, or nearly so.

From the appearance of the body, and from the evidence you have heard, what do you, as a medical man, say, you believe to be the cause of the death of that poor woman? - The mortification.

Can you tell us what was the cause of that mortification? - An impoverished state of the blood and juices; occasioned by what I cannot pretend to say.

How were the upper parts; the trunk, and arms, and face? - Very much ematiated.

Court. Did you hear what Mr. Young said, with respect to this ematiation, for he said that it was no more than he might possibly have expected to see in bodies that had not been starved; - Certainly, my lord.

Then you concluded nothing from that ematiation? - I did not.

Mr. Peatt. Is not it possible for a person who dies, having had every humane assistance, every indulgence, and article of food and convenience. Is not it possible for them to have the ematiated state you speak of? - It certainly is possible.

Is it not usual? - It is not so probable; I have met with instances of the kind.

Though the body may be ever so clean, it may be ematiated? - Certainly.

Can you say, Sir, by opening a subject a fortnight or three weeks after the death, at all, whether they died for want of food, or no? - I do not pretend to do it.

*** The Remainder of his Trial in the next Part, which will be published in a few Days.

PERMANENT INK, For Writings that require BLACKNESS and DURABILITY; made and sold by J. WALMSLAY, No. 35, Chancery Lane.

THE WHOLE PROCEEDINGS ON THE KING's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery for the CITY of LONDON; AND ALSO The Gaol Delivery for the County of Middlesex, HELD AT JUSTICE HALL in the OLD BAILEY, On Wednesday, the 25th of FEBRUARY, 1789, and the following Days;

Being the THIRD SESSION in the Mayoralty of The Right Honourable William Gill < no role > , LORD MAYOR < no role > OF THE CITY OF LONDON.

TAKEN IN SHORT-HAND BY E. HODGSON, PROFESSOR OF SHORT-HAND; And Published by Authority.

NUMBER III. PART II.

LONDON:

Printed for E. HODGSON (the Proprietor) And Sold by J. WALMSLAY, No. 35, Chancery Lane, and S. BLADON, No. 13, Pater-noster Row; and J. BELL, Royal Exchange.

MDCCLXXXIX.

THE WHOLE PROCEEDINGS UPON THE

KING's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery for the CITY of LONDON, &c.

The continuation of the Trial of William Patmore < no role > .

May not a person be in that impoverished state of the blood, and yet have every necessary of life? - Certainly.

I believe it not only happens so now and then, but very frequently, that persons in affluence, and having every convenience of life, and every species of luxury and affluence, that their blood is in an impoverished state? - I have not often met with it; it has not frequently happened in my practice.

Did you hear the evidence of the child? - I did.

You know the quantity of food she mentioned? - Yes; I should suppose it would rather increase and tend to impoverish, than add, from the quality of it.

The poor man at the bar is not a doctor; would that quantity of food in weight and measure, be sufficient to keep a person alive? - It is opposite to the course of diet I should have recommended.

But was the quantity sufficient in weight and measure? - I wondered, when I heard the stomach was in that weak state, that it should receive it.

Rather than supposing want of food? - Certainly.

Mr. Silvester. From what you have heard of the mode of feeding this poor woman, the manner in which she was attended, and the season of the year, and altogether, was it likely to occasion a mortification? - Most certainly.

Mr. Peatt to Mr. Young Give me leave to ask you the same question, Sir; would that quantity of food in weight and measure, be sufficient to keep a person alive? - If the question is confined simply to the food, no doubt of that, during the time it was given; I speak of the idea of one slice of bread and butter morning and evening, and a plate of potatoes and a red herring in the middle of the day; I collect a general idea of quantity, but I cannot say exactly what that quantity was. According to my idea of the quantity, I should think it competent to support life during the time it was continued.

Mr. Silvester. I have done.

Court. Prisoner at the bar; you have heard the witnesses that have been examined in support of the prosecution; what have you to say in your defence.

PRISONER's DEFENCE.

This here deceased woman, my lord, laid a matter of eleven days before she was opened; and for all the time almost I had her she had a violent oozing upon her, as she called it, which occasioned a deal of wet to be in the room; and her own child knows the same, and cannot deny it, if you ask the child; and she frequently used to spill her chamber pot about the room, which occasioned so much wet; so that the child was tired of waiting upon her, she said she was so nasty: she said that her father and mother both died of the dropsy; and she looked upon it she should die of the same; and the lodgers of the house said that her legs would burst a day or two after she died, if not before, with the dropsy; and about eight days before she died, she desired nothing but gruels, and no kind of meat. Rachel Walters asked her if she would have some wine in her gruel, and she replied no; she would have it the same as her poor mother had it, with a little salt and butter in it, she could taste nothing else, and her teeth were set for death. Walters said, why do you speak so, your speech is altered. She said, no, my mouth is clammed up; at the same time it was death that took hold of her, I believe; so that she never could eat any more. Then that, and being so long after death. I do not wonder, with that and the oozing I have described, that her body might be empty enough, notwithstanding she had the same food as I; and I being lame with a broken wrist, was not able to afford much; and many times, my child knows it, we have had but two red herrings between us, and two pound of potatoes, and have given her one herring and one pound of potatoes out of it; my child knows it.

WILLIAM HUFFLEY < no role > sworn.

I am a journeyman staymaker. I know nothing that relates to the death of Mrs. Patmore.

Was you in the house with the parties; or do you know any thing that passed a month previous to the death of the deceased? - No, I do not.

What is the prisoner's character as to humanity? - I always found him a good kind of a man, as far as I knew of him.

Was he deemed a churlish, ill-natured man? - Never, as I saw.

Did you ever see him in company with women, or with the deceased? - Never, in my life.

Was he esteemed a brutal, ill-tempered man? - Never, to my knowledge.

ANN CHRISSAL < no role > sworn.

I once saw the deceased. I knew the prisoner, as a neighbour.

Dow you know any thing of his conduct to the deceased? - No.

What was the man's reputation for humanity? - He bore the character, in the neighbourhood, of a humane man.

Did you see the deceased at all in the course of the last month of her existence? - No.

MARY HOCKER < no role > sworn.

My husband is a staymaker; I live in the Borough, just by St. George's church. I know the prisoner. The deceased I saw twice as she lay; I believe it might be a month before her death. I dined there, and saw what was sent up to her; that was about a month, as near as I can recollect; we had pickled pork, and turnips and potatoes; and there was a slice of bread, the length of a quartern loaf, cur near an inch thick; it was sent from the table, and there was large plate of pickled pork, potatoes, and turnips sent up, and a slice of bread near an inch thick, the whole length of a quartern loaf. The second day I dined before I went; I cannot tell what was sent then. The prisoner was reckoned, in general, a very humane man. I saw the woman.

Did she complain to you of ill treatment? - No, not at all.

Did she complain for want of food? - No.

Mr. Silvester. Did you go up to see her? - I did; I was desired to go up.

Who desired you to go up? - The second wife desired me. When I came up I found her laying on the ground, with some things under her; I cannot tell no further than this, I saw a piece of matting, but what was a-top of it I know not, for the woman was so lame she could not move.

What month was this in? - In November, or December.

Did Rachel Walters < no role > go with you up stairs? - I do not know Walters.

Why the second wife, as you call her? - Oh, yes, she went up stairs with me.

What time of the day was it? - It might be about two.

Was it before, or after dinner? - After dinner.

Who carried up the dinner? - The daughter.

What piece of pork was it? - The belly part of pickled pork; there was a large plateful went up; she was lame at that time, but very hearty seemingly, though so lame she could not move: she said she was with child, but I did not perceive it as she lay; she had a white swelling on her knee. There was more victuals sent up than I could eat; twice as much.

Did not you say to Mr. Patmore, that it was wrong to let a poor woman, who had a white swelling on her knee, lay so hard? - I knew he could not help it; he had never a bed for her.

But she might have gone to the workhouse? - To be sure that would have been the proper place for her; I have said that, and I went to the workhouse to see to get her in, when she was in labour; the prisoner came to me to the Borough, when she was in labour, and desired me to be kind enough to go the parish officers, for them to take her in, to lay in.

What parish officer? - Mile End, New Town.

What influence had you over the parish officers? - I had no influence over them, only to tell them there was a poor woman in labour, and begged them to fetch her. I live by the Swan Inn, in the Borough.

So this man came from Mile End, New Town, to desire them to take his wife in, because she was in labour? - He did.

Why, did not you make an observation, that it was very odd he should come to you into the Borough, when his wife was in labour, when it was much easier for him to have gone himself? - Very true, Sir, so it was. I cannot tell the name of the street where the parish officer lived.

How near to the street where Mr. Patmore lived? - It was in the dark, and it was in bitter frosty weather; but as near as I can guess, it was about a quarter of a mile to the first; but to me it was three or four miles. I have known the prisoner nine or ten years.

Do you know any thing of a lame hand? - Yes, I do; the board slipped as he was at work, and he fell off it, and broke his wrist, or strained it so that he was very bad for a considerable time.

When was this? - [Prisoner. That was five years this winter.] - I remember it exceedingly well; but the term and the time I cannot; but I know it must be years.

Was it within these six months? - Oh dear, no; I dare say five or six years ago.

Has he been able to work within these six months? - Yes, I believe he has.

What did he work at? - At staymaking.

Was he a poor man? - He was a poor man; he was a journeyman to my husband.

Was he very poor? - He was very poor.

JOSEPH HOOKHAM < no role > sworn.

The prisoner lived a neighbour to me, about four months; and while he lived and laboured with me, he behaved in a humane manner; there, was a poor man that was very ill, and his goods were seized; he was the one that went along with me gathering for him; we gathered about 17 s. and gave it to his wife; the prisoner behaved in a very friendly humane manner.

Court to Mr. Young. You have heard from one of the witnesses, that has beenexamined on the part of the prisoner; that the deceased had a white swelling in her knee; I should be very glad to know from you, as a gentleman of the faculty, what consequence that might have on her frame and habit? - There is no disease, with which the human body can be afflicted, that so much wears out the body, and takes so much time to do it in; the pain the patient suffers, if it is that species of white swelling, which is the painful one, and I believe her's was, for I recollect the knee was swelled; the continuance of pain, exhausts the strength in various ways; first, in itself as pain; we all know, that pain indisposes the stomach for receiving food, and for digesting what it does take; and by depriving the patients of their natural rest, greatly emaciates them, and generally in length of time, if nothing intervenes, proves fatal.

Mr. Young to Jury. You recollect, gentlemen, that the woman was carried up stairs when she was brought in. I perfectly recollect her knee being swelled; I think I can go so far, as to say it was her right knee.

Prisoner. It was the right knee.

Court. I would ask you whether or no, a disorder painful as that is, for of course you must know, might not occasion the groans we have heard mentioned? - Undoubtedly they would.

And it would account for that emaciation, which has been mentioned of in court? - No doubt.

Mr. Peatt. Would not the mere act of laying in one position so long, contribute greatly to produce a mortification? - It often does in itself alone, considering long confinement to a bed, even to a feather bed, is productive of mortification; in this instance, it was sufficiently connected with the idea of that which produced the mortification; that was my evidence.

Prisoner. I offered this Mrs. Riley, 2 s. or a weeks lodging in my second floor, if she would endeavour to procure a letter to get the deceased into the Hospital.

Court to Mrs. Riley. Did the prisoner offer you any thing? - He said if I would get him a letter for the London Infirmary to get her in, he would give me 2 s. for my trouble, and I tried, but could not get a letter; this was about five weeks before she died, for he said he did not know where to get one; he did not know any of the subscribers.

Court to Mrs. Riley. Do you know of any attempt that the prisoner made to get the deceased in the hospital? - Yes, two days I was employed to collect a little money to get linen, and to get her into some Hospital; I was employed by Patmore and Rachel, to gather money to get her linen and clean things, to get her to the Hospital; three days we were collecting money; the two days, I was paid sixpence a day by the prisoner; the last day I was not paid any thing.

Is he a very poor man? - He was then poor to appearance, because trade was dead.

Was he disabled do you know from doing his work? - I do not know.

Prisoner. I was not capable of working as a journeyman, being lame and my sight bad, so that I am obliged to do a little at home as a master.

The learned judge summed up the evidence to the jury, who immediately returned their verdict,

NOT GUILTY .

NOT GUILTY on the Coroner's Inquisition.

Tried by the first Middlesex Jury before Mr. Justice GROSE.