444. THOMAS HOMEDEN proceedingsdefend was indicted for feloniously stealing, on 16th of July , two mens leather shoes, value 5s. a pair of mens upper leathers, value 1s. the the goods of John Disney proceedingsvictim , privately in his shop .

THOMAS DISNEY < no role > sworn.

I am a shoe-maker ; I live in Duke's court, Drury-lane . On Wednesday evening last, about eight o'clock, the prisoner came to my shop, he came and asked me if I had seen Bill Starling? he is a young man that lives next door to me; I told him that I saw him about an hour ago, I had then seen him at his father's house, I told him he had better go into the house, and see him; he told me he would rather wait in my shop till he came out. I was very busy, packing up some goods for a young gentleman in the Temple; part of the things that belonged to that young man, were in a large press, and I went and opened a large pair of folding doors, to look for the remainder of the things, and the prisoner, in the interim, went away; I did not see him go. but as soon as he shut the door to, I missed him; I went to the window and see him pass; I live in the middle of the court, between Drury-lane and Bow-street, it leads out of one into the other, I see him run up into the court, I went after him; when he got to the top of the court, I missed him, but a person told me that that young man that came out of my shop, was gone in next door; I went there, and there I found him, and he was pulling a shoe out of his pocket; I said, you have taken some of my shoes; he said, yes, I have taken one, and here it is, I only took it in fun, and meant to bring it back; that is not all you have got, says I, I told him I had lost so many things, that I was determined to take him back. I took him back and I found these two shoes on him, one in one pocket and the other in the other; I took one out of his pocket myself; these are the shoes they are my property,I know them by the writing on them, they are not fellows, I have the fellows; he used very frequently to come into the shop, he is no business at all. I know nothing more than I have had some of his friends call on me since, but I never saw them before; I never saw one of his relations till yesterday or the day before.

Mr. Knowlys. That is half true and half not; it is true in words, but false in spirit. What value do you put on those odd shoes? - Five shillings.

Q. If you was to purchase them, would you give five shillings for them? - More money; but I would with, from the intercession that has been made to me by his friends, that you would shew him every indulgence you can.

Q. The question I put to you is, whether you would give five shillings for them two shoes? - Yes, I would give seven shillings for there two odd shoes.

Q. Besides these, I see there is a pair of mens upper leathers? - They were in one of the shoes.

Q. Can you swear to them? - I could if I was to see them; I finished them while the prisoner was in the shop; they went at the same time, but I never got them back again, and many other things.

Q. I did my duty for you before; I think I recollect your face before? - Very possibly you might.

Q. Where do you think I recollect seeing your face? - I cannot tell; you may have seen me in my shop perhaps.

Q. I never dealt with you, and I assure you I never will. Cannot you guess some other place? - It may be a great many places, perhaps; you might have seen me in Covent-garden Theatre.

Q. I may to be sure. Now I will guess where I see you, the last place an honest man should stand, at the bar of the Old Bailey? - When was that?

Q. About four or five years ago? - What was it for?

Q. I will try if I can guess. I can guess that a man, by the name of Disney, was prosecuted, by his own uncle, for forging on him, or something of that sort? - It was not for murder.

Q. < no role > Do I guess right? - You do not, you guess wrong.

Q. You was a very fashionable man once, went by the name of Count Disney. Do you swear that you was not prosecuted in this place for forgery? - I have not had an uncle for these ten years.

Q. It was not by an uncle, then, perhaps, it was by a master; then you was prosecuted by your master for forgery? - Was I guilty of it? there is the case.

Q. Do you ask me my opinion of it? - No, I don't ask you any thing about it.

Q. Was not you prosecuted by your master? - Certainly.

Q. You was acquitted of the forgery, but your master indicted you for the fraud, at Clerkenwell? - My master did not.

Q. Who did prosecute you for fraud, at Clerkenwell? - I was not prosecuted there.

Q. Where was you prosecuted, on the oath you have taken? - I was not prosecuted there.

Q. On the solemn oath you have taken, where was you prosecuted? - There was a bill of indictment preferred against me here.

Q. What was the bill of indictment for? - I don't know what it was for rightly.

Q. Was you convicted of that or no? - I was.

Q. Did you suffer a year's imprisonment on it or no? - I did.

Q. What did they say it was for? What did they charge you with? - With signing a man's name, which I never did.

Q. But, I believe, that man said that he never signed that name, and they saidyou signed it for him? - I don't know how that was.

Q. < no role > Don't you know how that was, when you was tried and convicted. Why then we must try you and convict you again, for there is no other way to brush up your memory. I believe you undertook to prosecute this man for petit larceny? - I believe he was committed for petit larceny, but I signed nothing.

Q. I see from a petit larceny you have changed it to a capital offence. Did not you authorise Mr. Dyke to go to the friends of this lad, and tell them that if they paid you two guineas, you would not indict him at all? - No, I did not. Mr. Dyke is at the door, call him in.

Q. You will recollect that, I don't want to take you by surprise. To your knowledge Mr. Dyke never made such an offer? - No, he did not; they came and offered me any sum if I would not prosecute.

Q. When they came to you, did not you acknowledge that you sent Dyke to them? - No, I did not.

Q. You did not then add that if the twenty pounds were not given, you would prosecute for a capital offence? - No, I never said so.

Q. You knew this lad very well a long time? - I knew him from Christmas but I did not know his friends before.

Q. And you knew Bill Starling < no role > very well? - Yes.

Q. He is a person that is backward and forward very often? - He very frequently called in.

Q. Now the prisoner said, when you overtook him, and he was pulling out the shoes, that he was only playing with you, he only meant it in a joke? - Yes, after I found he had got the property on him, when he see me come into the passage, he put his hand into his pocket directly.

Q. The boy was very well known, and you knew where to find him? - No, I did not know he had any lodgings at all.

Q. Is there a day in the week in which you have not seen him? - I believe if I had not seen him so often it would have been better for me; I see him very frequently, but not every day.

Q. Another thing I would ask you, as you are a compassionate man; I believe before the magistrate you pitied him very much; did not you make great expressions of compassion towards this lad? - No, I did not.

Q. Did not you say you was sorry for him? - No, not at all. I told the magistrate that I had been very frequently robbed, and amongst the duplicates that were found there was a brush that I had lost.

Q. The magistrate committed him for a petit larceny, and you have now compassionately indicted him for a capital offence. Was not you bound over to prosecute for a petit larceny? - I was not. I conceive that in law I was not bound over, for I signed nothing.

Q. Was it not said to you that you acknowledged yourself to be indebted to our Lord the King, on condition that you should prosecute this man? - That was mentioned.

Q. Was not you bound over to prosecure him for petit larceny at that time? - I did not sign any paper or book at that time.

Q. The man was committed for petit larceny? - He was.

Prisoner. I leave it to my counsel.

THOMAS WHITEMAN < no role > sworn.

I am no relation to this lad, nor ever exchanged five words with him in my life; I am a watch-maker, in Cecilcourt, St. Martin's-lane; I live with my father, but I carry on the watch-making business distinct; I know a man of the name of Dyke, I was at Mrs. Moore's,in Princess-street, Thursday evening last, I believe she is sister to the prisoner; it was the evening of that day on which the boy was committed; Dyke was there, he said, that he came from Mr. Disney, respecting the prosecution of Homeden, that Mr. Disney was concerned for the friends of the lad, and for the lad, and that he was willing not to prosecute, and that he would not prosecute him if Homeden's friends would pay him twenty pounds, as an indemnification, and that if the twenty pounds was not given, he would then prosecute him at the Old Bailey, that he would not find the bill according to the instructions of the magistrate, but he would value the goods at five shillings, enough to make it capital; he said, he would go as far as he would; and, I think, he said he would make it capital. This gave rise to conversation, whether he would ever be sued or have any thing to pay; it was mentioned to Dyke, if in case they had any inclination to give Disney the money, suppose they gave him a note instead of the money, whether that would do; Mr. Dyke said, that would be compounding felony, and we never can recover on such a note.

Q. This gentleman is a precious limb of the law. Was the proposal rejected or acceeded to? - It was rejected.

Q. In consequence of this you was advised to go to Mr. Disney to know if Dyke came with his authority or not? - Yes, I went there with Mr. Homeden, a relation of the prisoner's, yesterday morning; I did not ask the business direct; in the course of a few minutes I asked him if he had seen Dyke since he was at Princess-street, at Mrs. Moore's house, since last night? he said, that when Mr. Dyke returned, he was not at home when he came in the first time, and when he came in the second time, he, Disney, had gone to bed, and that he had not seen him; Mr. Dyke was not in the room, I had not understood that he lived in the house till then; he afterwards came down stairs, from some part of the house, and came into the room. I asked Mr. Dyke if he would use his influence with Mr. Disney, to get him carried to the quarter session? he said, he had not spoke to him, but as I was there I had better speak myself. I mentioned to Mr. Disney that the magistrate had instructed him, and that he could not act wrong, if he abode by his instructions, for I heard the examination.

Q. Did Disney admit or deny in the course of the conversation, that Dyke came by his authority or not? - He admitted it. The business was again resumed respecting the note, and the present of the note, Dyke directly replied it cannot be done, it will be compounding felony, it is against the law; he said, that two men could not enter into an agreement to murder a man; on Dyke saying this Mr. Disney took part in the conversation, and said, that he remembered an instance when he was at the Oldbailey, of a woman being brought forward who did not prosecute some person, and that a letter was fens to her, that he left Mr. Shelton talking to a woman, telling her the consequence, that it was very bad; I went on purpose to know whether Dyke came by his authority or not. When I said his friends would give no money, Disney replied, if I was to take money I don't know whether I should do right.

Not GUILTY .

Tried by the first Middlesex jury before Mr. RECORDER.