954. JAMES SCOTT proceedingsdefend This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . , THOMAS PICKERING proceedingsdefend , and SUSANNAH JOHNSON proceedingsdefend were indicted for feloniously coining a farthing, against the statute , October 7th .

(The case opened by Mr. Silvester.)

WILLIAM BOWYER < no role > sworn.

On the 7th instant, between five and six in the afternoon, I went on an information to Widegate-alley, Bishopsgate-street , to Scott's house, I went in at a window from a back-yard, and then down stairs into a back kitchen, and there I found a door fast that went into a front kitchen, Morant who was with me, knocked at the door, they asked who was there, he said, a friend; I opened the door, and the three prisoners were close to the press, the two men were without coats or hats, the woman without a bonnet or cloak, but in her usual dress, there were a large quantity of blanks on one side the press, with a die set, and several farthings on the other side; these I took from under the press; the men were dirty, the woman had on a white apron, I heard Clarke say when he looked at her hands, I am very sorry for you.

Mr. Garrow, prisoner's councel. There was some brandy? - Yes.

Had you any of the brandy? - No; the woman said she came to give them some brandy.

SAMUEL MAYNARD < no role > sworn.

On the 7th of October, I went to this house with Mr. Clark and some other officers; Bowyer and Morant and me went down through Scott's house, through the shop into his kitchen; Morant knocked at the door, they asked who was there, he said, a friend, Bowyer laid hold of the door and strove to wrench it open, I stood exactly in the middle of the door, and as it split down I saw the woman (Mrs. Johnson she called herself,) get up by the press, the men were on each side of the press; she then stooped right before Pickering, I laid hold of him, there were a great many blanks struck on one side and the other.

Mr. Garrow. Did you drink any of the bra ndy? - Morant had a little, and I had a drop.

It was very good I hope? - There was a bottle of brandy there, and there it was left.

Where was this? - In London.

Where did you carry the prisoners to? - To Bow-street.

So you gave Guildhall and the Mansion-house the go-by? - I went according to orders.

JOHN CLARKE < no role > sworn.

I went to Widegate-alley, on an information which was given to Bow-street, that there was coining in a house adjoining to the prisoner Scott's, and that the way of going into that house, was through the shop, through the kitchen, and to throw up the window, and go into the adjoining cellar at the yard door, and we should find the people at work; being lame I was not so nimble as I formerly have been, and the other officers went in first, I left the prisoner in custody, and went and searched, I saw the three prisoners, the two men were without clothes, the woman without a cloak or bonnet; there were dies fixed in the press, and a quantity of blanks: I was then curious to look at the woman, and I said then, and I say now, I was sorry to see any woman in that situation, I examined the woman, and I have not a doubt -

Mr. Garrow. I must stop you, you are the last man I should stop; but I should object the same if my Lord Mayor was a witness? - I have not a doubt, Sir, but you would object to my Lord Mayor: I am sure the woman had been handling of copper.

Did you examine her hands? - I did indeed, and I repeated the words to her, good woman, I am sorry for you!

Were her hands dirty? - They were.

Court. Were her hands black as if she had been handling copper? - There is no doubt, it is certainly a fact, there was a mark where the blanks and things had been handled.

Describe in what manner this business is done? - There were three people in the cellar, they were locked up, when those springs are in, and the press runs up to the screw, it comes to its purchase, and these springs raise it up again, therefore it must require more strength than if they were in the press; here are the two dies that were fixed in the press at the time, and a quantity of blanks: there is a hole sunk in the earth, in order that the press might not come over their head, therefore they are covered in the earth, that the fly of the press might have more effect.

How many people are employed at this business of coining? - The only practice that has been proved in this Court, is three, one each end of the fly, and another to feed the press.

Mr. Garrow, Prisoner Johnson's Council. Do you know anything of the practice of coiners in making farthings, but by hearsay? - I do not.

Then you do not mean to swear that farthings are not sometimes made by coiners without the assistance of a third person? - It is impossible for me to swear that.

How were the woman's hands, dirty? - Her left hand was dirty in the palm, and all the way up.

Do you remember her shewing her hands to the Magistrate, and saying they were clean? - I do.

And she said that, therefore, she could not be employed in coining? - She did.

Then did you say to her, your hands were dirty, but you have wiped them on your apron? - No, I did not.

Had she any opportunity of washing her hands? - No.

Prisoners Pickering and Scott. My Lord, we are both guilty, we would not wish to give the Court any trouble, but the woman is innocent.

The prisoner Susannah Johnson < no role > called one witness to her character.

JAMES SCOTT < no role > , THOMAS PICKERING < no role > ,

GUILTY .

SUSANNAH JOHNSON < no role > , NOT GUILTY .

The two prisoners, Scott and Pickering, having been once before convicted for a similar offence, and had the benefit of the clergy, the Counsel for the prosecution prayed that judgment of Death might be passed upon them pursuant to the statute.

(The record of the former conviction of James Scott < no role > This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . , read by the Clerk of the Arraigns.)

Court to Scott. You hear this plea, on the part of the Crown, which states, that you have before been convicted of felony, and prayed the benefit of the statute, which has been allowed to you; the law is, that no person can twice claim that benefit; therefore, it avers that you are the same person to whom the benefit of clergy was allowed on a former occasion; you have a right to deny that fact.

Mr. Garrow. I recommend it to you to deny that there is any such record, and that if there is, you are not the person.

Prisoner Scott. I any those facts, I am not the man.

Court to Prisoner. When the Jury are called over, you have a right to object to any of them, if you will.

The Jury called over, and not being objected to, they were sworn as follows.

"You shall well and truly try the issue

"joined between our Lord the King, and

"the prisoner; whether the prisoner at the

"bar, James Scott < no role > This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . , was convicted of felony

"at the Old Bailey, on Wednesday the

"16th of October, in the twenty-second

"year of his present Majesty's reign, and

"whether he is the same person that was

"tried and convicted, and received the

"benefit of his clergy."

Mr. Garrow examined the counter plea, and observed a variance, the record of conviction saying, the prisoner was tried before Sir George Nares < no role > , Knt. and the counter plea stating only Sir George Nares < no role > , and it went on to state that he was tried upon an indictment, for that one William Voteer < no role > , late of the liberty, & c. without giving the Court that tried that Voteer, any jurisdiction to make that enquiry.

Mr. Garrow My Lord, the plea varies from the record, but that is not all, it does not state by force and arms, there is a difference in the essential part of the record; the conviction set out in this plea, may be a conviction had at York.

Mr. Silvester. The counter plea does not profess to state the indictment.

Mr. Garrow. It says upon an indictment for that, & c.

Mr. Silvester. The counter plea has nothing to do with the jurisdiction in this record, it does not profess to set forth the whole record of this man's conviction, but states the fact, that the prisoner has had his clergy once.

The Court reserved the objection.

JOHN TOWNSEND < no role > sworn.

Do you know Scott? - Yes, perfectly well.

Was you present in Court here when he was tried? - I was, it was in January Sessions, 1782, I put him to the bar myself, he was tried with Isaac Voteer < no role > and Dean.

Is that the same man? - Yes.

Mr. Garrow. Do you know whether he was acquitted? - I heard the Court pass sentence immediately, of a fine of one shilling, and twelve months imprisonment; the Court passed sentence immediately, on account of the lameness of Isaac Voteer < no role > .

Court to Jury. This is a novel prosecution, the general law of the kingdom most undoubtedly is that what is called the benefit of clergy, shall not be allowed to any man twice: in all cases of felony, excepting where it is expressly taken away by act of parliament, by the common law of the kingdom the benefit of clergy was allowed; the reason and origin of which began in times very different from the present, and when the church enjoyed very peculiar privileges as distinguished from the laity; the privilege in question, was in fact the benefit of clergy, for it was a privilege peculiar to those in holy orders; distinguished from others, that though the punishment of the law was death to men in general, yet they had the privilege of not suffering death, in those cases where another man would: in process of time the humanity of the government, and the liberal principles of the law, extended that privilege, by fiction and implication, to all those who could read, for that was considered as a sort of test, and the question whether the culprit was a clerk or not was extended to the enquiry, whether he could read or no; so much of the original of it was retained down to the very modern period; but women were not entitled to this very valuable privilege, for it could not be presumed that they could be clerks in holy orders, and therefore women were allowed to be executed: but by acts of parliament in more modern times, the benefit of clergy, which is and ought to be, if allowed at all, allowed without distinction, and without any reference to the cause of it, was allowed to all persons who committed simple felonies, and taken away from particular offences; and the law holds it shall not be taken away by any act of parliament, even where the law says he shall suffer death, unless the words are added without benefit of clergy; so that, as the law now stands, every man found guilty of any crime from which the benefit of clergy is not taken away, shall, upon praying it have it: but the law says, that though this indulgence shall be once allowed to a man that commits a lesser felony, he shall not be repeatedly intitled to it, and that he shall not be entitled to it a second time: the prisoner Scott has been convicted by your former verdict of an offence for which he is intitled of right to demand the benefit of his clergy, and he has so demanded it by praying the benefit of the statute, to which, say they, on the part of the crown, he is in a situation that does not entitle him so that privilege, for he has received that benefit once, therefore we object to its being allowed to him another time; and they have put into court a plea, which states, that he was tried for felony, and convicted, and prayed the benefit of the statute, which was allowed him, and they say that the said James Scott < no role > This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . now at the bar, whom you have convicted, is the same, and by conclusion of law cannot be entitled to it again: James Scott < no role > This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . denies that, he denies all the facts in the plea, he says further, if there was any such conviction, he is not the same person: the record is now produced and read of the conviction of a James Scott < no role > This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . , upon which some questions of law arise, about which it is unnecessary to trouble you, because your verdict will not affect those questions one way or the other: Townsend swears the prisoner is the same James Scott < no role > This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . , you are therefore to decide whether the evidence of this witness is sufficient to satisfy you that the James Scott < no role > This name instance is in set 1362. This set is in the group(s): GarrowsClients . at the bar, is the same man that was before tried, which is the only question for you to decide; if you find that he is the same man, and if the proceedings are sufficient against him, he will receive judgment of death; if you have any doubt he is not the same man, you will say so, and in that case he will receive a sentence, such as the offence may deserve upon the indictment, on which he was before convicted.

Mr. Shelton, Clerk of the Arraigns. Gentlemen of the Jury, do you find for the Crown or the prisoner?

Jury. For the Crown.

Mr. Garrow. If your Lordship pleases, that the sentence may be respited.

Court. Certainly.

GUILTY, Death, Sentence respited .

The Remainder of this Trial in the next Part, which will be published in a few Days.

THE WHOLE PROCEEDINGS ON THE KING's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Gaol Delivery for the City of LONDON; AND ALSO The Gaol Delivery for the County of Middlesex, HELD AT JUSTICE HALL in the OLD BAILEY, On Wednesday the 19th of October, 1785, and the following Days;

Being the EIGHTH SESSION in the Mayoralty of The Right Hon. RICHARD CLARK < no role > , LORD MAYOR < no role > OF THE CITY OF LONDON

TAKEN IN SHORT-HAND BY E. HODGSON, PROFESSOR OF SHORT-HAND; And Published by Authority.

NUMBER VIII. PART V.

LONDON:

Printed for E. HODGSON (the Proprietor And Sold by J. WALMSLAY, No. 35, Chancery Lane, and S. BLADON, No. 13, Pater-noster Row.

MDCCLXXXV.

THE WHOLE PROCEEDINGS UPON THE

KING's Commission of the Peace, Oyer and Terminer, and Goal Delivery for the CITY of LONDON, & c.

Continuation of the Trial of J. Scott and T. Pickering.

Mr. Shelton to Thomas Pickering < no role > . Hold up your hand, you stand convicted of felony, what have you to say for yourself why this Court should not give you judgment to die according to law.

The counter plea read and examined with the record by Mr. Garrow.

Mr. Garrow. My Lord, I submit that after this is filed, and read to the prisoner, the Court will not suffer the Crown to correct it.

Court to Prisoner Pickering. Do you deny the truth of this counter plea or admit it? - I deny it.

The Sheriff returned the same Jury.

(The Jury sworn.)

- FRYER sworn.

(Produced a copy of the Record.)

This is a true copy.

Mr. Garrow. My Lord, here is an objection in this case, which seems to me to be fatal, it is said that it was presented in manner and form following, it is essential to that, that it should be after the twentieth day.

Mr. Silvester. The whole of it is surplusage.

Court. Gentlemen of the Jury, in this case you will not be troubled with the trial of the issue, for the plea put in is clearly wrong in point of law; therefore I am to direct you to find the verdict for the prisoner.

Verdict for the prisoner.

Court to Prisoner. You have had the good fortune to escape the danger under which your companion still labours, by a mere mistake in point of law, which I am bound to allow you, but with an admonition, that you will avoid the danger in future, which you have subjected yourself to, and which it might have been expected you would have avoided after your first conviction; but unhappily for you it has proved otherwise, and you have brought yourself into a situation by which you would have forfeited your life, and that with great justice; but under the circumstances that have occurred, your sentence is to be fined 1 s. and imprisoned twelve months in Newgate .

Tried by the first London Jury before Mr. RECORDER.